Why settle for referrals when you could be getting killer introductions instead?
Joining Samantha in this episode of Influence By Design is Bill Cates. They’re diving into the world of radical relevance in an exceptionally noisy market, exploring how you can sharpen your marketing message, cut through the noise, and win more ideal clients.
Bill shares his expertise on referrals, differentiating them from introductions, and why the latter is the golden ticket to business success.
Whether you’re a business owner, coach, or professional looking to grow your client base, this episode is packed with actionable insights.
IN THIS EPISODE YOU’LL DISCOVER:
- The importance of cutting through the noise and being relevant in today’s market (00:53)
- Compelling means action — The role of emotions in decision-making (02:39)
- Turning aspirational issues into compelling, urgent needs (04:43)
- Referrals vs. introductions, and why introductions are far more effective (06:30)
- Tips on making introductions stick and creating connections that are safe and effective (10:15)
- Why it’s crucial to provide context during introductions (16:01)
- The value and pitfalls of networking groups (19:26)
- The power of stories in making your pitches memorable and relatable (22:46)
- Why it’s crucial to have genuine confidence in your value (26:18)
QUOTES
“If you’re not relevant, you’ll be ignored; and if you’re not compelling, you’ll be forgotten. And so we need both of those working together at all times.” – Bill Cates
“Build relationships with people so that you’re able to give a really compelling introduction. It’s a really great way to take that introduction to the next level.” – Samantha RIley
“If you stand up and tell a little story that brings the work you do to life, people will get it, and you’ll stand out.” – Bill Cates
“It’s not you trying to build your business, it’s you’re on a mission. You’re on a mission to bring this important work to other people, and the most comfortable way for them to meet you and for you to meet them is an introduction from someone they already trust.” – Bill Cates
“As humans, we’re meant to connect. So giving and receiving introductions is a beautiful way to connect and do business in a way that isn’t just transactional.” – Samantha Riley
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WHERE TO FIND BILL CATES
- Website: https://referralcoach.com/
- Website: www.RadicalRelevanceBook.com
- LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/billcates/
- Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thereferralcoach/
- Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ReferralCoach/
- YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@BillCatesReferralCoach
CONNECT WITH SAMANTHA RILEY
Facebook: Samantha Riley
Instagram: @thesamriley
LinkedIn: Samantha Riley
Twitter: @thesamriley
TRANSCRIPTION
Samantha Riley 0:10
Welcome to today’s episode of Influence By Design. I’m your host, Samantha Riley, and today I have Bill Cates with me. We’re going to talk about how you can become relevant or have radical relevance in today’s market, and we’re going to touch on referrals and how these two topics come together. So Bill, welcome to the show. It’s great to have you here.
Bill Cates 0:34
Great to be here, Samantha, and in case people misheard, it’s not Bill Gates. Bill Cates, with a C, my little fun phrase is Bill Gates has a lot of money. Bill Cates, that’s me, I’m going to help you make more money by finding and serving more clients.
Samantha Riley 0:53
Love it, love it. Love it, love it. So let’s start off with radical relevance, because it is an exceptionally noisy market right now, more noisy than we’ve ever seen in any other time in history. We need to be radically relevant as a business owner. How did you, I guess, stumble on this topic and start to really give some form to this topic, I guess?
Bill Cates 1:23
Yeah, thank you. The subtitle of the book kind of says it all. Sharpen your marketing message. Cut through the noise. Win more ideal clients. So it is noisy. A lot of competition for people’s attention. And so what I learned early on in business, many, many years ago, is that the more relevant, the more narrow our perspective, the more bullseye relevant we are in terms of our messaging, the clearer we are in who we’re trying to attract, the words we need to say to grab their attention, and then not just be relevant to get their attention, but compelling to move them to action. I like to say, if you’re not relevant, you’ll be ignored, and if you’re not compelling, you’ll be forgotten. And so we need both of those working together at all times. And forever I’ve been working with referrals, as you’ve mentioned, helping professionals get more referrals and introductions. And so when you get referrals, introductions, well, what comes next? Talking about your value to that prospect. And so then how you talk about it’s going to make a difference whether it moves forward or not. If you’re not relevant and compelling, they’ll, you know, they’ll ignore you. So that’s kind of how it all fits together for me.
Samantha Riley 2:39
Totally So you talked about being compelling. What does that mean? We all know what the word compelling means, but how does it relate to us as a business owner? Like, what does it include?
Bill Cates 2:55
It means creating action, really. It means getting movement on the part of the other person. It could be initially getting them to think a little differently, feel a little differently, but ultimately, in most cases, when we’re messaging, we’re trying to create some sort of action, whether it’s to do business with us, whether it’s to click on a lead magnet we have on our website, whether it’s to do something that we recommend to them as a coach or as a professional or providing advice. So a couple things that goes on in compelling. First of all, there’s been research done by a famed neuroscientist by the name of Antonio Damasio, and he is this, he has proven what we’ve all sensed. So we’ve all sensed that people make decisions emotionally, right? That’s what moves people along. Well, he’s proven that by measuring subjects that had the part of their brain that felt emotion was damaged, they couldn’t feel emotion, and therefore they actually couldn’t make any decisions. And so no emotion, no decision. They couldn’t decide they’re going to have corn flakes or wheat flakes for breakfast unless that they already had the habit established or maybe a list. And so he’s proven what we know is that every decision, every human being makes is based on emotion. Now sometimes people ask, Well, what about statistics? What about, can you have compelling statistics and information? And yes, of course you can. What it does, though, is it elicits an emotional response that then moves people forward. So that’s one thing that’s important to know around this idea of compelling. The other thing, and I cover in my book, Radical Relevance, is a concept I learned from a venture capitalist near Boston, Massachusetts, and he calls it, building a business around solving a blatant, critical problem, so meaning, the prospect to our business knows they have the problem. Blatant and critical, meaning, it’s not aspirational. It’s not something they’ll get to someday. It’s they’re bleeding money, they’re in pain, emotionally, physically, something, right? And they have a deadline, you know, to get their taxes done, whatever it is, right? It’s compelling. And so it’s always easier to find people and grow your business when you solve a blatant, compelling, relevant problem. Now, some, not all, businesses can be that way. Sometimes we have to dig a little and kind of show them that there’s a problem, and sometimes we have to help them realise it shouldn’t be just aspirational. So for example, I do a lot of work with financial advisors and financial professionals. And if you take life insurance as an example, a lot of people know they should probably have more. They probably don’t have enough to protect their family or loved ones or business should something unexpected happen. But a lot of people treat it as aspirational. You know, I’ll get to it eventually, right? Yeah. But if you say, All right, what’s the cost of doing nothing? And this is what’ll take an aspirational perspective and make it compelling, critical, is what’s the cost of doing nothing? What’s the cost of not moving forward? What’s the emotional cost, what’s the financial cost, right? And that’s usually how you can go from aspirational, compelling with a lot of people. So that’s kind of what I mean by compelling. If that makes sense, I hope.
Samantha Riley 6:30
Yeah, totally. Let’s move into referrals. Because before we were recording, you and I were talking, and you know, a lot of business owners love referrals. I love referrals. They’re the easiest way to get clients. However, a lot of people don’t have a system for doing this or understand the background of how they even get the referral. Can you talk us through how the topics of relevance and referrals crosses over.
Bill Cates 7:10
Sure. Well, as I mentioned earlier, you know, the fastest way to relevance is a referral. And I really should say introduction. I like to make a distinction between the two, even though we’ll use the word referrals. I see a referral as kind of like call George, use my name. Well, George doesn’t answer the phone if he doesn’t know who’s calling or the text or the email, and he’s wondering why his friend’s giving his name out to someone he doesn’t know. That just doesn’t work very well anymore, because of all the noise, etc, and all the barriers that people will put up. Right? So the way to cut through all that is to get that introduction, that connection. Now, why do people, why are people not as good and talented and as they could be around getting referrals or introductions? There’s a lot of things. First of all, sometimes it’s a mindset. A lot of people will see referrals as kind of the icing on the cake. You know, if you do a good job, people will refer me, and that’s good, that’s important, and that creates unsolicited referrals or introductions, and those count, especially if they’re to the right types of people. But if you think, and most, most of the folks listening to this, I know that their ideal clients would prefer to meet them through someone they already trust. And my little expression is the way the world is meeting people through other people, and the referral, the introduction, is the warm way we get into their lives. So doesn’t it make sense to build a business based on how people want to meet you? So it’s not the icing on the cake. It really is the cake. And getting referrals and introductions is not just about asking, although I do teach people how to do that without looking like the creepy referral guy, which is, I get that a lot. When people come to me for coaching, they say, Bill, is there a way to do this without looking like I get creepy referral guy, cheesy referral guy, sleazy referral guy. They don’t want to look like that, yeah, and I don’t blame them. So a lot of it starts with the mindset, and then ultimately it has to do with building confidence. And we can certainly talk about that, but it’s not rocket science. It’s really all about confidence, just like everything else in life is.
Samantha Riley 9:22
I love that you gave a distinction between referrals and introductions. And here’s the funny thing, I give introductions almost every day of the year. Most people in my world, I give introductions for all sorts of things. I hadn’t even realised there was a difference. But now you say it, I think about other people saying, Oh, I told so and so to call you, well, they’re never going to call. That an introduction is so much, so much better. And I hadn’t realised that I intuitively did that. For the people who it’s not so intuitive to, can you maybe give them some tips on how to do that? Because that’s also something I get asked, How do you do these introductions? And sometimes I’m not good at articulating this, because it actually does come really naturally to me.
Bill Cates 10:15
So we’ll warm up to the answer first by saying that while word of mouth is nice, we appreciate it. Occasionally, it turns into opportunity, certainly. It’s usually not enough in most businesses, and so we need to think in terms of connection, right? So whether we bring it up from our side about someone we know, they know, or they say, Hey, you should talk to my friend, or whatever, the conversation is not done until we’ve arranged, negotiated, collaborated for a good connection, a good introduction. Now, there are a lot of ways to get introduced. In person is great, as long as the logistics of meeting in person don’t get in the way and take a long time, and then, and then, you know, the enthusiasm wanes and it doesn’t happen. So if, if they meet for drinks or breakfast or golf or whatever, and that’s a natural thing to create, then, by all means, that’s a great way to get introduced. Now, a lot of folks are having success with three way Zooms. These days, we’re so more accustomed to zoom and all the other platforms like that that are out there, that when you have a client or an influencer who really wants you to meet someone, really values your work, and that someone is indeed interested in talking to you, then that three way Zoom can be very effective, very efficient, kind of a nice fall back if the in-person doesn’t work. And then my favourite, personally, because it’s so efficient, is an email handshake, an email introduction, where, let’s say, if you’re introducing me, Samantha, you would say to Laura, Laura, I want you to meet Bill Cates, here’s why I’m introducing you. Bill, here’s how I know Laura, couple of personal things about each other. One of the key elements in this is why I’m introducing you. Let me tell you why I’m making this connection that makes it more relevant and a little more compelling. And then I would then follow up with an email. So in a sense, you’ve protected your relationships with, relationship with Laura, because she’s heard from you first, but you don’t have to try to figure out how to, you know, catch her and talk to her and, you know, you just make a little bit of an introduction, and then I follow up, and my goal is to have a quick phone call and then move forward from there. So that’s kind of my favourite. I call it an email handshake. I recommend that you find your favourite, what seems to work the best, and then say to your introducer, say, here’s what I found works the best. It’s a nice phrase. People always want to know what works the best and but then be flexible based on their relationship and all that sort of stuff, in terms of see what, what you’ve done is you, you, you see yourself as a connector. You see yourself as someone who helps others by making these connections. Now, to make connections, to give referrals, to make introductions, one could argue there’s a little bit of risk there. You never know exactly how it’s going to play out, right? Because humans are involved, so therefore a lot of people don’t make introductions. They hesitate to do that. You don’t want to take that risk, but that’s a disconnect, because if you’re afraid to do that, how are you going to get clients and others to do the same for you? And so I encourage people to think of themselves as connectors. Help friends, colleagues, family members, clients, you name it, just by making connections for folks, not forcing people to connect, but just. And you know, everybody’s familiar with the Golden Rule, do unto others as you would have them do unto you. I have the golden rule of introductions. Introduce others as you would have them introduce you, right? So make good connections. And what you could do, probably, Samantha, is you demonstrate really the best way to make a good connection. And they see that, and they get it. You follow up. Have you two talked yet, right? A little bit of that. And, and, boy, then you get a much better connection. So you’re teaching people how to do it as you’re doing it yourself.
Samantha Riley 14:23
I love that. There’s two things I want to touch on, or really shine a light on that you said there. Number one is giving context by saying this is why I’m introducing you. Because it is super weird when you get an introduction. You have no idea why you’re being introduced. It’s almost a little like, I almost am afraid to do something with this introduction, because I don’t know where it’s going. So I think that context gives safety. And the other thing you’re saying is you have a lot on the line when you make introductions, and that’s why people don’t like to do it. This is something I talk about a little bit, even though this isn’t my area of specialty, in that introduce people that you do know. So for me, I’m guessing, have been, I’ve been in business for over 30 years. I’m guessing you’ve been doing this a while too. I’ve got a reputation. I’m not going to just introduce someone that I haven’t worked with or I don’t know very well. It’s why I personally don’t like BNI type groups, where you have to give introductions to someone that you may not have worked with or you don’t really know very well. I prefer to build relationships, and I’d love you to actually go to touch on that after we finish this piece, but build relationships with people, so that you can give a really good introduction. It’s a, it’s a really great way to sort of take that introduction to the next level.
Bill Cates 16:01
Yeah. So here’s my philosophy around introductions, and it’s really kind of a principle. I like to talk in terms of principles, strategies, tactics. We know that principles rarely change. Tactics change based on context. So the principle is that, a couple of principles. First of all, the conversation is not done until we’ve gotten connected or arranged for the connection. The other is we need to create a connection that feels safe and is effective. You know, in the United States, the Food and Drug Administration, when it approves a drug for the market, the criteria it’s looking for is that drug safe and effective. And my guess is Australia, it’s probably very similar, and in any, almost any country, right? And so that’s what we want for introductions, safe and effective. Or another way to think about it, is comfortable and relevant. So meaning it’s got to feel comfortable for the, you know, if you’re introducing me to Laura, I want it to feel comfortable to you. I want to feel comfortable to Laura, effective. Well, I’d like it at least pique her interest in talking to me. So we’re going to talk about that. Let’s talk about how we create a safe, effective, comfortable introduction. And what do you, what I like to do first of all is I like to learn about the new prospect from the introducer. Because if you’re introducing me to Laura, you know some things about her that I probably couldn’t get from her LinkedIn profile or Facebook page or anything that I, you know, cold research is, talking to you is what I call warm research. So I’m going to ask you, tell me why’d you think of her? How do you think she’ll respond to this? What’s going on in her life or her business that’s really important to her? I’m learning about this person first, and then together, we’re crafting, you know, a comfortable and relevant connection, and that way, I’m also helping the introducer feel good about the whole thing. You know, a lot of times people will say to me, Bill, how would you like me to introduce you? Which I love, because I don’t like people that just haul off and introduce me in most cases, because they often say the wrong thing, or they don’t say anything like you would mention. It’s like they it’s like, Samantha, meet George. I think you guys should know each other. Have fun, right? So if you know, if I got that, I would, you know, I’d go back to the introducer first, and I say, thank you for this connection, this introduction. Give me a little more context, please, right? Why are you making the connection? What do you think the fit is? All of that so, so then I can respond in a more relevant way, or I might, you know, realise it’s not really a good fit, and we may just let it languish and not go anywhere.
Samantha Riley 18:54
Yeah, yeah, totally. You said something then, and I was going to ask a question, and it’s completely flown away. I hate that.
Bill Cates 19:08
Oh, I do too. It happens all the time, and it has nothing to do with age, by the way. No, definitely not. No. It’s just a little part of the brain that, if you don’t cement the thought within, about, for about seven seconds, it goes away. So …
Samantha Riley 19:26
100%, 100%. Alright, so you’ve talked about giving the introduction, talked about giving context. You’ve talked about building relationships. I did mention something about networking groups, and I picked up a funny little look from you. I would love to ask you from someone who is an expert in referrals, I’d love your take on that, like, should I be looking at these networking groups in a different way, like just what I said gave some sort of response, and I’d love you to respond to that.
Bill Cates 20:10
Yeah. I mean, I have nothing against networking groups, they can be very effective for certain types of businesses. So here’s first of all, here’s the principle at play. For anyone to either, or for anyone to refer you, if you will, or introduce you to others, you’ve got to be referable, right? So now, if they’re a client, and they’ve experienced your value, well, now they kind of know of what they speak, right? They say, you know, she did a great job. He did a great job for me, here’s how I, you know, I benefited. You should at least talk to her, talk to him, right? So, but in networking groups, quite often, you’re getting people who aren’t your clients introducing you to others. So they’re not going to do it if they don’t really, truly get a sense of your value. So it, number one, it usually takes a little time for that to build up. Obviously, the Trust has to be there. They have to know what your process looks like. They have to know how you’re going to reach out to someone. It’s a risk. And so they, you know, you got to solidify that relationship before they’re going to introduce you. Also with networking group, it depends a little bit on the kind of business you’re in. So for instance, most people have noticed that in BNI and the other types of groups that are out there, the people that tend to get the most leads and referrals is that, you know, the sign maker, the basket, the gift basket person, you know, things that are pretty easy. They’re tangible. They’re kind of easy to recommend, easy to refer. The tougher ones are your audience, where it’s, you’re selling an intangible, whether you’re a coach or an accountant or a financial advisor, it’s intangible. You’re almost selling a real, you know, a relationship. And so that’s tougher. So you got to work on your referability and meet outside the group. Most of the good groups do encourage their members to meet outside, and that’s important because and then eventually, what I found happens, is that you’ll either find a group that is made up of the types of folks that will come to appreciate what you do and be willing to introduce you. Not everyone in the group will do it, but some will rise to the top. Or you may find a group where you just can’t make that happen. It’s just made up of individuals that just, they just don’t go there for whatever reason. And you may need to find another group, so that’s, that’s a part of what goes, goes on there. And then one final thing, when you have your time in front of a group, when you stand up and say, here’s what I do. You know, elevator pitch, or whatever. I call it a value positioning statement, it’s almost always better to tell a little story, a little anecdote, just a real simple, you know. The formula for a story is, I had a client or I had a prospect. Here was their challenge. Here’s how they felt about it. Very important. Here’s how they felt about the challenge. Here’s the work we did, here’s the result, and here’s how they feel about the result. And I guarantee if you stand up and tell a little story that brings the work you do to life, people will get it, and you’ll stand out from all the other people, you know, reading their brochure bullet points when they’re in front of the group. So the power of a little quick story or anecdote can really make a difference.
Samantha Riley 23:43
I love that so much. That comes back to the context. People don’t want to sit there, and I have done this, and I went to school here, and I work with these people, and I’ve got this doctorate, like it’s just, you know, well, A, most networking groups are in the morning. It makes your eyes glaze over. You’re not awake yet. But number two, if we can see through or get that feeling or see someone else’s experience straight away, we’re like, oh, either that relates to me, or the first thing you think is, oh, my goodness. I was just chatting to Mary yesterday, and she was talking about this problem. That’s why I should definitely introduce this person to Mary.
Bill Cates 24:25
And people listen to stories differently. In my book Radical Relevance, I have a chapter on the neuroscience of relevance. So I did a little studying of neuroscience and whatnot. I researched the research, if you will. And so we learned that really the way the brain lights up is different when someone tells a story, and even brains start to synchronise a little bit. If you’re telling me a story, especially when it has a little emotion in it, our brains actually start to synchronise. It’s pretty cool. So by the way, I have a guide. It’s free. It’s something for all your listeners. And I’ll just give it to you now and then you could probably put in the chat or whatever, but it’s absolutely, minute, minutecasestudy.com. www, dot minute, M, I, N, U, T, E, case study.com. It’s free. Go get it, and that outlines the little formula that I just gave you. And you start telling these little minute case studies. I mean really, literally, you can do it in a minute. You will see a difference. You will see how people warm up to the work you do. Get to understand the work you do a little bit better. People become more interested in what you do and interested in you, because you have your ability to tell a little bit of a story.
Samantha Riley 25:41
I love that, and we will definitely pop that link in the show notes wherever you’re listening. It will be just down below. Thinking about everything that we’ve talked about today, because we’ve covered a lot, not just referrals, about being relevant, compelling, all of the things, for someone that’s listened to this episode, what is one thing that you want to leave them with today?
Bill Cates 26:10
Wow. Can I give two quickies?
Samantha Riley 26:14
Absolutely, absolutely
Bill Cates 26:18
Well at the heart of referrals, relevance, introductions, is making sure that people understand and see your value and that your expectations are being met. And so we’ve all heard the expression of working on our relationship, on our business versus in our business, we also need to work in our relationships and on our relationships and so with your clients checking in from time to time. And when you do this, how you do this will vary depending on the business, but taking a time out and say, you know, let’s, let’s put everything else aside. Let’s talk about one thing we know we can control, which is our communication, our overall working relationship, any place for not meeting your expectations, any place that isn’t working for you. Now, most of the times, people are going to go to the positive, they’re just going to, oh, no, I love you. I love that. But every now and then, you know, you find a little something that needs a little tweaking. And we all know, and here’s a principle, that a relationship that’s had a problem, that’s been handled well, is a stronger relationship than one that’s never had a problem. So you look for that to strengthen your relationships, and then now you see the values being received. They feel that by articulating it. And this is a good starting off point to promote or ask for introduction. So that’s one thing. The other thing is, all of this thing around introductions and referrals, it’s got to stem from your true belief in your value. You got to really feel good and believe in what you bring that you, that you know when you’re introduced to folks, darn good chance you’ll be able to help them in some way. They may not become a client. Maybe they are, but you bring value, and you bring and you believe in that, and that’s where it comes from. It’s not you trying to build your business, it’s you’re on a mission. You’re on a mission to bring this important work to other people and the most comfortable way for them to meet you, and for you to meet them is an introduction from someone they already trust.
Samantha Riley 28:26
I love that so much. I love giving introductions. I love receiving introductions. I think that it’s a really beautiful way to do business, because, as you said before, we like things go well when we feel things and as humans, where we’re meant to connect. So giving and receiving introductions is a beautiful way to connect and do business in a way that isn’t just transactional. And I think that that’s the most important thing for me, because it’s way above transactions. It’s about creating something bigger than us. That’s just my take on it.
Bill Cates 29:03
Well, it’s true, and especially for the folks listening, right? Anyone in a kind of a service based business, it is all relationship, and it’s, and process or process, depending on where you’re from. And, yeah, it’s all about that is no question about it.
Samantha Riley 29:23
Yep, love it so much. Bill, thanks so much for coming today and sharing. Where can people find out more about you if they want to stay connected?
Bill Cates 29:32
Yeah, thank you. So my book that I think people will find helpful is Radical Relevance. You can get it on Amazon, I know, in Australia, in the United States and other parts of the world, underneath my mug here on the video, it’s Radical Relevance book.com and then my website is referralcoach.com. Just go there. Have a look. Send me a message. I love to interact. I love to talk to folks, happy to see if I can be a resource.
Samantha Riley 30:01
Thanks so much, Bill. I really enjoyed this conversation today. Thanks for sharing all of this value that is be able to be used by anyone that’s listening. So thank you so much.
Bill Cates 30:13
Thanks for having me. Appreciate it.
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